[vL]Kp said that only the most gifted of programmers should get c++ books and newbies should not. So I wonder how does a newbie become a pro w/o books?

By not listening to Kp?

I wanted to see if what he was saying was true. Cause then how did people become good programmers w/o reading others?

[quote author=Telos link=board=30;threadid=5635;start=0#msg47944 date=1078612998]
By not listening to Kp?
[/quote]

That's word-for-word what I was going to say.


Get books, C++ For Dummies and More C++ For Dummies are excellent.

That isn't what I said. Not that anyone listens to me.

Kp when i came into op [vl] earlier and asked u what books u recommend you told me that unless you're a gifted programmer you dont deserve books. You also said because ppl who cant program get books thats why so much crappy software is out there. At least that is what I remember from our conversation. I'm not trying to give u a bad name or anything.

Btw thanx for the tip iago.

Haha. Kp is entirely correct. If you are a crappy programmer, and you get books showing you how to do more, you will write crappy software.

OTOH, if you learn to be a skilled programmer, e.g. a hacker, you will have a better chance to write good software.

This reasoning recommends that you learn to be a skilled programmer before you end up writing crappy software. Learning a language is not how to do this. Learning to analyze, document, design, code, debug, test, and deploy is how you become skilled. Then, no matter which language you learn, you should be able to be a hacker.

Lets take me for example i know nothing of c++. I want to get c++ books so i can learn c++ and get "skilled" at it. Isn't that the only way for me to learn c++?

That is one way. But it will mostly show you how to program in C++, not show you how to program. Learning to program should be its own course, independent of the language.

[quote author=Grok link=board=30;threadid=5635;start=0#msg48023 date=1078633716]
That is one way. But it will mostly show you how to program in C++, not show you how to program. Learning to program should be its own course, independent of the language.
[/quote]

It would have been a lot easier to get were I am now if I would have known that when I started (not that I am very far). ;D I remember the days when I programmed in Visual Basic and didn't really have a clue what I was doing, I just knew how to use the language to a certain extent.

It is amazing how much you can accomplish if you are really serious about it.

So now what have you accomplished?

[quote author=Rock link=board=30;threadid=5635;start=0#msg48059 date=1078674544]
So now what have you accomplished?
[/quote]

[quote]It is amazing how much *you* can accomplish if you are really serious about it.[/quote]

That was supposed to be an uplifting comment for you and anyone else interested.

My accomplishments:
- I have a fairly strong understanding of OOP
- I understand the basics of how primitive data types/arrays work and are stored in memory. Bytes, bits, and how to manipulate them.
- I understand how to document my code properly
- I have recently started testing my code. Wow was that a hard thing to start doing.
- I can now analyze and design my projects in a manner that is completely independent from any programming language.
- I have learned to write clean, organized, and fairly optimized code. In my opinion anyways.
- I have learned how to read the fucking manual. Please excuse the language, but this is a huge thing. Now I can look it up myself instead of asking to many stupid questions.
- The most important thing I have learned is to believe in myself. I used to limit myself, because I never thought I could be anything.

There is a lot I have learned, and if I can do it so can you!

Well hopefully i can too. So far i've learned very little.

By the way, "C++" is not a very descriptive topic for a message in the C++ forum. :p

lol mah bad.

As long as you keep at it, you'll never fail.

[quote author=MrRaza link=board=30;threadid=5635;start=15#msg50359 date=1079677002]
As long as you keep at it, you'll never fail.
[/quote]

Well you might fail along the way, but sooner or later you shall succeed. ;)

[quote author=Tuberload link=board=30;threadid=5635;start=15#msg50369 date=1079684932]
[quote author=MrRaza link=board=30;threadid=5635;start=15#msg50359 date=1079677002]
As long as you keep at it, you'll never fail.
[/quote]

Well you might fail along the way, but sooner or later you shall succeed. ;)

I agree."MosDef"


[/quote]

Get books, C++ For Dummies and More C++ For Dummies are excellent.
[quote][/quote]

I Tried that C++ for dummies, the new Bloodshed Dev-C++ compiler on it didnt work, it was ver5 of it some new features but it was still in beta form and when i went to compile anything It would always crash my comp, it was CraZy

I've never had a problem with dev-c++, it's my compiler of choice when my usb harddrive is unplugged, and it hasn't failed me yet.

Although "crash my comp" isn't terribly descriptive.

Finally, what, if anything, does that have to do with the topic at hand, besides completely defeating what Grok said about learning HOW to program/think before doing actual programming? Perhaps you were trying to be ironic, I guess :/