hey guys,
im completely new to all this programming stuff(with visual basic) and it would be GREAT if you could send me some beginner tips and guidelines. ive taken computer science in school but they only taught me Turing and it sucked. So i just wanna forget about all that turing bull and learn how to use a better programming tool such as VB6 or c++.
I am especially interested in learning how to make bnet bots, so if u could help me out with that i would be extremely thankful!
goblin

[me=Eternal]notices the viewing count for this post but lack of replies :o[/me]

Goblin, perhaps the best form of advice you could get for a general programming issue like this is to get a book, try some of the online tutorials and certainly don't start with trying to program/understand how bnet bots work. If you have specific programming questions along the way, there are plenty of people on this forum to help.

Start with some tutorials on the basics and learn all the ingredients needed that would perhaps go into a more advance program, such as coding a bot.

Hope it helps, and good luck.

[EDIT: One last thing, VB6 is easier to pick up if you have no programming experience, but the more experienced programmers here try to avoid it and prefer other languages such as C++ - learn to walk first before you run]

At the moment, im looking around for books already, but as for online tutorials, i cant find any good ones that'll help me.
if you know of a good site, it would be great if you could tell me.
thanks!
goblin

Are you learning VB .Net or 6.0? First off, establish a book to get. If you are interested in VB6.0, than again as I always do, www.johnsmiley.com look for his VB 6.0 set. I've got all 4 books and they were great I think. I'd suggest learning VB.Net though opposed to 6.0, because a lot of what you learn in 6.0 might work but might not work in .Net. IE: Currently I'm unable to finish a program I'm doing an update to in .Net because I originally created this program, which is based off an access database, in DAO (Data Access Objects) and .Net doesn't support DAO without some SERIOUS changes. ADO.Net is the new way to go, but I've yet learned how to work with it. Also a lot of key components, such as Control Arrays, no longer exist in .Net but there are alternative methods, such as Collections etc..

So Id suggest finding a good book and reading it. Mind you the worst way to get help is to say you want to make a b.net bot because if you want to learn to program simply for that, save yourself the time and effort and just use someone elses. If your really want to learn, then get a book as stated multiple times and learn from the beginning and don't even ask yet how to make a bot.

OOT or the black Turing? Turing (as opposed to what I originally thought) is alot better than I thought, I mastered turing (I can do anything internally with it now) in one year... And now I can sleep through this year's computer science lessons and I'm learning how to manipulate circuits with turing now (computer engineering). If you weren't using OOT then I'd recommend that you learn that fully (f10 or f11 is the help file with a list of ALL commands) and then move on to something more practical (I'd much rather have learned jscript over VB...).

Where do you live? The last I know Turing wasn't offered anywhere besides Toronto/Ontario.

eternal,
so should i go with c++ considering that i might not like VB6 anymore in the future?
another question; to learn c++ would i need any background with VB?
i just need to know which language i should use before i go out n spend like...$100 on a book.
thanks
goblin

No, you do not need to know VB to learn C++. They are seperate languages, and any programming language (like turing) will help you learn it. If you are dedicated to learning a useful language and are willing to spend a lot of time, C++ is probably your best choice. Otherwise VB can pretty much do the same stuff and doesn't require as much theory.

Do a search on this forum for differences between VB and C++, I remember reading quite a few threads on it, then decide which one suits you best.

jok3r's right Goblin. Personally <confession time> I don't have the time to learn C++, so I've become proficient with VB. It is also easier to learn if you have no programming experience. It really does depend on how dedicated you are and of course how easy you can pick things up. Everyone will tell you C++ is a better language and I won't argue with that.

[EDIT] Grrr, typo spotted about three hours later.

One question I have is, how could anyone not have the time to learn C++? By looking at my watch I see that I have, hmmm, let's say a possible 80+ more years to live. If you could only spend an hour a day reading, and then applying what you read you could learn the language. You don't have to spend hours upon hours to learn a language. Just learn it's syntax/structure, and read up on important libraries and such. From there just refer to some sort of C++ manual when ever you run into a problem. Time is the only way you can master anything, and thank god most of us have plenty of it.

BTW this post was not meant to offend anyone.

www.vbtutor.net www.vbexplorer.com

No offence taken. I just find it hard to juggle a wife, 7 month old baby, running a company and a starcraft clan!
Still, it's all good fun.

One day I'll try it. Maybe it's not as hard as I think?

[quote author=Tuberload link=board=31;threadid=3327;start=0#msg26719 date=1067630902]
One question I have is, how could anyone not have the time to learn C++? By looking at my watch I see that I have, hmmm, let's say a possible 80+ more years to live. If you could only spend an hour a day reading, and then applying what you read you could learn the language. You don't have to spend hours upon hours to learn a language. Just learn it's syntax/structure, and read up on important libraries and such. From there just refer to some sort of C++ manual when ever you run into a problem. Time is the only way you can master anything, and thank god most of us have plenty of it.

BTW this post was not meant to offend anyone.

[/quote]

I'm sorry but that was a pretty stupid post. If you take the time to just learn the syntax and structure of a language and can't apply any common sense as to how it works or any theory behind it, then why bother learning the language? If you write a simple line such as Textbox.Text = "Hello world" or cout << "Hello World\n"; and don't understand what the stream operator means or the purpose of assigning information to a property of a certain object, then you won't get very far in my opinion.

Take the various differences between Visual Basic 6.0 and Visual Basic .Net in terms of omiting the use of Control Arrays, a very touchy subject that I've learned to ease up on sinse I've learned the new method to be a lot more efficient than its predecessor. If you write VB6.0 code such as:

[code]
Dim i as integer
For i = 0 To 4
txtTextBox(i).Text = ""
Next i
[/code]
If you learned this code and understood it to be looping through the control array and clearing each textbox's text property, then wouldn't the beginning programmer ask the theory or something like that about the use of index's with control arrays? How do they work? Whats the purpose behind having such a technique?

What about switching to the new Collection technique in Vb.net?
[code]
Dim ctrl As Control
For Each ctrl In Controls
If TypeOf ctrl Is CheckBox Then
Dim chkCheckBox As chkBox= CType(ctrl, CheckBox)

If chkCheckBox.Checked Then
Msgbox("You've clicked a checkbox!")
End If
End If
Next ctrl
[/code]
How could you simply take this syntax and understand how collections work? How could you learn the structure of how it works without asking other questions?

Unless I've been mistaken in the intent of your post, I find your reason behind not exploring anything beyond the simple structure of syntax to be of no use to helping a person learn a language from a beginners standpoint.

[quote author=Eternal link=board=31;threadid=3327;start=0#msg26724 date=1067639667]
No offence taken. I just find it hard to juggle a wife, 7 month old baby, running a company and a starcraft clan!
Still, it's all good fun.

One day I'll try it. Maybe it's not as hard as I think?
[/quote]
Well I guess you have a point there. Drop the starcraft clan and use that time to learn C++. ;D I personally don't think learning a programming language is to hard. It just takes practice.

DarkVirus: I think you did misinterpret the meaning of my post. What I was getting at is once you learn the syntax of a language it is fairly strait forward from their to build upon your knowledge of the language.

[quote]If you could only spend an hour a day reading, and then applying what you read you could learn the language.[/quote]

Wouldn't that cover pretty much cover everything you stated? I am sorry if I didn't break down the obvious for everyone. I was just trying to get the point across that if you want to learn a language it does not necessarily have to take up your whole day.

[quote author=Tuberload link=board=31;threadid=3327;start=0#msg26726 date=1067640578]
[quote]If you could only spend an hour a day reading, and then applying what you read you could learn the language.[/quote]

Wouldn't that cover pretty much cover everything you stated? I am sorry if I didn't break down the obvious for everyone. I was just trying to get the point across that if you want to learn a language it does not necessarily have to take up your whole day.

[/quote]

One hour a day is pretty much. Most busy people won't be able to spend that much time.

[me=Eternal]falls into that category.[/me]
Hmm, anyone tried reading during sleep?

I sometimes DONT sleep so I CAN read and learn While normally I'll fall asleep in the process, I've yet to successfully sleep AND read at the same time. 8)

For the record, I obtain information via osmosis during sleep.

[quote author=CupHead link=board=31;threadid=3327;start=15#msg26784 date=1067695175]
For the record, I obtain information via osmosis during sleep.
[/quote]

I keep my laptop sitting on a book, mostly for ventalation, but I figure it couldn't hurt if my laptop learns 64-bit assembly :)

I'll admit, im a newb at vb, but i learned a lot just by experimentation. The first 3 things i learned have become my crutch when working with VB:

If>Then>else Statements
Dim Statements and variables
Basic Code setup (controlname.propertyname = propertyvalue)

That laid my groundwork. Another helpful thin in VB6 is if you type part of a piece of code, and it's correct, then it will try to auto guess the rest, which is fun to experiment with. Also, if you start typing something and let it sit, a cool small yellow box will pop up with the syntax, which is always helpful when trying something new.

My advice to all, is hands on experience is the best teacher. If your a newb at VB i suggest starting with calculators and working your way up.

Alright, so C++ it is!
i figure, if im gona spend a good amout of time on something, i might as well spend it on something worth my while.
now i just gotta find the time to get my ass to a book store and buy the books!
oh and just so i can get a good idea on how much ill be spending; what will a good c++ book cost me?

thanks guys! you've been lotsa help!
goblin

[quote author=Goblin link=board=31;threadid=3327;start=15#msg26803 date=1067703111]
now i just gotta find the time to get my ass to a book store and buy the books!
oh and just so i can get a good idea on how much ill be spending; what will a good c++ book cost me?
[/quote]

At a book store you'll probably end up spending between $50-100.

[quote author=Goblin link=board=31;threadid=3327;start=15#msg26803 date=1067703111]
Alright, so C++ it is!
i figure, if im gona spend a good amout of time on something, i might as well spend it on something worth my while.
now i just gotta find the time to get my ass to a book store and buy the books!
oh and just so i can get a good idea on how much ill be spending; what will a good c++ book cost me?

thanks guys! you've been lotsa help!
goblin
[/quote]

www.campusi.com

Search the used market and buy a decent book. As always, I suggest www.johnsmiley.com as my author of choice, but after not getting into C++ for a few years (this was 6 months back...) I reverted to Deitel and Deitel. C++ How To Program 4th Edition. Great book. Love every step of it. Informative as well as resourceful for any need in my opinion. Just the book will run (used) around 50 bucks which is opposed to the retail of ~100. If you get it WITH the software its around 75 for the package opposed to 115 bucks. Assuming you've aquired an illegal version of a C++ compiler (or already have one regardless) then go with the standard edition. I don't recommend ANYTHING from the Microsoft Press so don't waste your time.

I recommend going to Barnes & Noble or Books-A-Million, or any bookstore that has some comfortable sofas. Standing in front of the shelves, glance through the VB books until you find a few that you can read easily. Each book is written differently, you need an writer and style that you can understand. Also, the content has to be presented in a way that makes sense to you.

Take those books and plop down on the chairs, read through about 20-25 pages of each one. Buy the one you're most comfortable with learning the best from.

you may also want to try
http://www.vtc.com/vb6.htm
very good movies/clips that teach you the basics of Visual Basic it helped me alot may i also suggest for someone around my level to check out
http://www.valhallalegends.com/cuphead/
cleanslatebot is a very stable and easy to use OCX which allows you to connect to bnet with out knowing the packets or having a packet logger i for one never got my packet logger working.

If you need help fell few to post a message here or msg me on aim