If you use IE browser you often see the scrollbar on websites different color and style then the standard scrollbar look.

That effect is achieved with the illegal scrollbar style properties. These properties are not defined in any CSS specification and are not part of W3C standard.

A good web developer/designer would never use anything that is not a W3C standard. :P

If you don't want to display these illegal scrollbar style properties on your browser read this W3C article below.

http://www.w3.org/Style/Examples/007/scrollbars.html

Note: This forum uses these illegal scrollbar style properties for the Message window.

Personally, I think that if it looks good, use it. I've used scrollbar colors and all that, it helps add to the appeal and appearance of the website.

[quote author=Invert link=board=22;threadid=1554;start=0#msg11674 date=1054861984]A good web developer/designer would never use anything that is not a W3C standard. :P[/quote]

I don't want to go too off-topic of Scrollbar styles, but would like to elaborate on this quote.

A good developer would do what is appropriate for the task, with heavy consideration given to following standards. He will deviate from those standards only when there is good reason and when the reason is a requirement of the current task.

The standards body recommendations should be followed when you have no good reason to do otherwise. In most situations where a programmer is considering doing something nonstandard, he could probably adhere to the standards and produce more maintainable code.

[quote author=ch33z3 link=board=22;threadid=1554;start=0#msg11678 date=1054874584]
Personally, I think that if it looks good, use it. I've used scrollbar colors and all that, it helps add to the appeal and appearance of the website.
[/quote]

The only problem with that is what looks good one place will not look good many others. A good web design should meet the needs of as many people as possible, not a minority for the sake of coolness. Don’t want to loose customers.

The point of my post was to inform people about the scrollbar style properties, a lot of people use it not knowing that it's not legit CSS and not all browsers will display that.

Grok: I totally agree with you, the statement that I made about the good developer/designer was not meant to sound that general but to apply to things like scrollbar style.

Many new devices are coming online like cell phones, PDA's etc... with their own versions of browsers (that follow the W3C standard) these versions of browsers would have a hard time displaying your website if you deviate too much from writing good mark up and styles. If you follow the standards it will look good for everyone.

Hmm..

This is a little off topic of scrollbar-styles, specifically, too, but I think this topic has veered more into...

I think the W3C has simply turned into an excuse for the open-source community's -- Mozilla, Konqueror etc. -- failure to compete with Microsoft as far as web-browsers go:)

Who's The W3C to dictate which technologies I can and can't use?:)

I mean, c'mon. They make recommendations, lets not forget this...

Personally, I say stick to your niche and their browser's abilities.

If your niche is typicaly going to use IE 5.5 and IE 6, stick to their -- and your -- abilities.

It wouldn't make sense to create a solution for IE 6 when your intended niche is teen-aged Linux zealots:)

Your response demonstrates a comprehensive lack of understanding of web technologies, protocols, internet bodies, standards, recommendations, browsers, the companies that make them, and even good programming.

How one small post can be so absolute in its idiocy astounds and amazes me.

But I suppose this explains the part of your name next to the underscore.



P.S. Invert feel free to delete these off topic replies. This flame was deserved but unwarranted on your forum.

Flaming, heh. Interesting.

You do realize that without standards there would be no portability what so ever? How do you expect things to work if everyone is off doing their own thing?

Any good web browsers should implement the W3C standards, then add some extra little goodies if it wants.

Another point, have you ever heard of ANSI (American National Standards Institute)? Who are they to tell you how to program in C, or any other language? Who are any other standard setting companies? The W3C is no different.

This is not meant to be a flame, just to give you some information to ponder on. Then maybe you can change your name to Semi_Competent_Canadian ;D

[quote author=Tuberload link=board=22;threadid=1554;start=0#msg11723 date=1054927475]
This is not meant to be a flame, just to give you some information to ponder on. Then maybe you can change your name to Semi_Competent_Canadian ;D[/quote]

Would it really help as long as "_Canadian" is on there?

Good question...

I don't think I'll delete that Grok. I am a strong believer in tough love :P

P.S. This is not the General Discussion; I have no rules about flaming. If it's a rare thing there won't be a need for a rule.

[quote author=Tuberload link=board=22;threadid=1554;start=0#msg11723 date=1054927475]
You do realize that without standards there would be no portability what so ever? How do you expect things to work if everyone is off doing their own thing?

- Quite right, and I do. I also realize that the majority of features The W3C's specifications contain wouldn't exist if it weren't for their introduction as proprietary features. My point wasn't to ignore existing standards, my point was not to ignore the current proprietary features simply because they're that, proprietary.

- Another point, have you ever heard of ANSI (American National Standards Institute)? Who are they to tell you how to program in C

- Indeed, I'm quite familiar. I'm also familiar with the fact that the ANSI organization, like The W3C, compiled their specification based on the widest used proprietary extensions to Bell's original introduction.

- I don't think my original point was interpreted properly, heh. I wasn't encouraging people to ignore existing standards. I was encouraging them not to ignore current, proprietary extensions to these standards. I was also ranting about how The W3C has clearly failed to keep their specifications, at least for CSS, current with the widest used proprietary extensions[/quote]

I dont think its "Illegal" professional company's use it all the time

JoeCool, how should I put this gently... You're a moron!